200A and 202 reproduction
frames back
in stock.

markamulvaney
I have a 1946 220D that has never burned properly. Dull yellow looking as if it’s not getting enough air but the air intake tube mixing chamber and burner tubes screens and caps are clean. Could this be my problem? Where the generator goes into the air intake tube the hole is enlarged Click image for larger version - Name: B8C9B081-A206-4DE5-86B8-C779D0E31972.jpeg, Views: 126, Size: 10.83 KB
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nomis1
That definitely could be your problem. If you have another air tube, you could try swapping it and see if that solves your problem.

Simon
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WYSIWYG
That is your problem. I had a 200 like that . you can test it by wrapping it and sealing it up with some tin foil.
John        
One in every public place...

ICCC #1338    IDITOS  #2654
Coleman 275 Appreciation Syndicate. Member #0059
BernzOmatic Appreciation Club #004
Member of CCF  Chromostereopsis  Club
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Smudge
I agree with the above. Also, I had a 220E with a similar situation, and the problem was the bend in the air tube was kinked/flattened. Same solution. Replace air tube.
"If all the beasts were gone, men would die from a great loneliness of spirit, for whatever happens to the beasts,
also happens to the man. Whatever befalls the Earth, befalls the sons of the Earth.” - Chief Seattle

ICCC # 1726  -  Bernz0matiC Appreciation Club #057
Perfection Heater Collectors #6
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markamulvaney
Thanks for the tip I’ll try it tomorrow and get back with results
Mark
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Mister Wilson
That oversized generator hole is definitely your problem.
John
H.C. Lanterns dealer
Coleman 275 Appreciation Syndicate #2001 A Turd's Odyssey
Canadian Blues #028
Coleman Slant Saver #31
Looking for 6-56 and 6-58 Birthday lanterns.
There's been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about.
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markamulvaney
Will the burner assembly off any 220 interchange?
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Murff
Any 220/228E or earlier. 
Murff

Name: Murff   ICCC Member #726 
Coleman Blue's 243's #002   Ebay Handle: Happy-campers2 
EX-ICCC Newsletter Editor & Full time Coleman Addiction Enabler
Part-time Idito and Hater of Turd 275s
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BobS
Hi

Could someone please explain how that causes a problem since air is going through the tube any way. The generator slides into the whole so its not air tight to start with. Does it leak air out of the hole when its to large?

Thanks
Bob
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Aspbear
Two things happen when the opening is enlarged. First you are getting more air and that air going in is insulating the generator so the vapor process is hindered.
G.B. Harp
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Mister Wilson
I can't give you any kind of scientific answer, hopefully someone comes along that can.  What I think happens is that the intended air flow gets disturbed by the gap around the generator.  Air is supposed to enter through the bottom of the air tube, and it's drawn in by the expanding vapors spewing out of the generator up into the chamber.  The gap around the generator breaks up that suction and disturbs the swirl in the chamber.

I rebuilt a Leacock lamp for a customer last week.  When I pulled it apart I noticed that the generator hole was large and made note of it.  I completely disassembled everything, cleaned inside and out, brand new generator and 2C-HG mantles.  It was noticeably dimmer than it should be, and over drove the mantles unless I turned the cleaning tip up a little.  I returned it to them and explained that it wasn't as bright as it could be and I thought the tube was the problem.  They had given me two lamps to repair.  The second one had a good tube, and was much brighter when I finished with it.  Exactly the same work was done to it.  Yesterday when I returned it, they gave me the dim one back...because it was dim!  They had also put 24A mantles on it, which had very black bottoms.  I brought it home, miraculously disassembled the burner without breaking the mantles (I had fired it with them on, and wanted to see the difference), replaced the air tube with a new one with a nice tight hole, put it together and fired it up.  That new tube made such a big difference that with 45 psi pressure it completely filled out those big mantles and was very bright. 

Sorry for the long story, but since I just experienced this I thought I would share.  Replace the tube, you won't be sorry.

Edit: Guess I was writing a book while G.B. said the same thing short and sweet. Lol!
John
H.C. Lanterns dealer
Coleman 275 Appreciation Syndicate #2001 A Turd's Odyssey
Canadian Blues #028
Coleman Slant Saver #31
Looking for 6-56 and 6-58 Birthday lanterns.
There's been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about.
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Aspbear
LOL yours sounded much more professional than mine. I guess I am from the Jack Webb era "JUST THE FACTS MAM"

How the heck did you get a air tube out without tearing the mantles. Impressive
G.B. Harp
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markamulvaney
John would it be a fair test to put it back together and seal the generator hole up with Ultra Copper hi temp Permatex? Would sealing it up completely also cause a problem? I have used that copper permatex on a Exhaust manifolds on automobiles so it will take the heat
Mark
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WYSIWYG
Other John here, Did you see my earlier post where I said you could test the theory with some tin foil? A lot less messy than permatex.

Here is a link to a 200 with the same problem.
http://www.colemancollectorsforum.com/post/poor-output-on-200a-yellow-mantle-soot-black-spots-6842202?
John        
One in every public place...

ICCC #1338    IDITOS  #2654
Coleman 275 Appreciation Syndicate. Member #0059
BernzOmatic Appreciation Club #004
Member of CCF  Chromostereopsis  Club
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Mister Wilson
Like other John said, try some foil or something less messy first.  If that works, go ahead and try the Permatex.  Sealing it up completely shouldn't cause any problems, but don't slather it all over the generator.

Quote:
How the heck did you get a air tube out without tearing the mantles. Impressive


HA!  I impressed myself.  I really wanted to use the same mantles for a good before and after.  I took my 11/16" open end and carefully got a bite on the burner caps to break loose the burner tubes from the casting, carefully unscrewed them, turned them mantle up and stood them on my bench.  I thought it was even more impressive because 24A are bigger and floppier.  Changed out the air tube and carefully screwed the burner tubes back in place.  When I started I thought there was about a 10% chance of success.  One thing that made it easier was the fact that I had just disassembled it all the week before.

BTW, for those not familiar with the Leacock burner, it's virtually identical to a Coleman 220, that's why I used it as an example.  In fact, the air tube that I replaced was off a Coleman 220 lantern.
John
H.C. Lanterns dealer
Coleman 275 Appreciation Syndicate #2001 A Turd's Odyssey
Canadian Blues #028
Coleman Slant Saver #31
Looking for 6-56 and 6-58 Birthday lanterns.
There's been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about.
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Aspbear
Very impressive. I have saved a few mantles on like a 288 where I can lift the complete unit off but like that My chance would be zero. I can look at a burnt mantle and it will fall off. Good job
G.B. Harp
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markamulvaney
Well guess what !! I put the lantern back together filled the hole surrounding the generator as best as I could and BINGO !! That 220D is running like a rocket!! Nice and bright, I’m so tickled. Next question does any one have a burner assembly available? I’ll check with Old Coleman parts tomorrow. Thanks everyone for all the help you’ve made my day!! Click image for larger version - Name: 787C2B31-CBDC-496A-AD1A-D83901B42F2C.jpeg, Views: 80, Size: 8.30 KB Click image for larger version - Name: 2DA4F4B7-D598-4891-BED3-B939380F8BEB.jpeg, Views: 81, Size: 13.54 KB
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Mister Wilson
I have a couple from 220Es that are available.  Do you want just the air tube or the whole burner?  I checked the gen holes, nice and tight.
John
H.C. Lanterns dealer
Coleman 275 Appreciation Syndicate #2001 A Turd's Odyssey
Canadian Blues #028
Coleman Slant Saver #31
Looking for 6-56 and 6-58 Birthday lanterns.
There's been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about.
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Donnellym
I think you have just barely enough foil on there! Just kidding around. The lantern looks like it’s running great! I’ll keep that troubleshooting tip for myself too. Mark
Mark
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Donnellym
Now I’m curious how that hole could have gotten enlarged? Seems to me even if somebody was rough with a genny replacement that the generator would just bend instead of doing that.
Mark
Mark
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Aspbear
Usually it is someone trying to use the mixing chamber or manifold to tighten or losses the air tube. It gets misshapen and then someone tries to straighten it with a screwdriver and the generator hole gets enlarged.
G.B. Harp
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markamulvaney
I ordered a used burner assembly from Mike at OC Parts today along with some other goodies. Thanks again to everyone I’ll post a money shot when it’s all completed.
Mark
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Gand28
Aspbear wrote:
Usually it is someone trying to use the mixing chamber or manifold to tighten or losses the air tube. It gets misshapen and then someone tries to straighten it with a screwdriver and the generator hole gets enlarged.


+1.  You do it once, and if you are a learner, you don't do it again...
Greg -- Fiat Lux!
ICCC Member #1273
Seeker of Canadian Nickel!
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treimo
Congrats on getting it figured out! Same thing happened to me this weekend on a Sears I’d gotten; tube was so mid-shapen i couldn’t get the gen in without forcing and then it was hard to get the flared end down to attach the nut. When I finally did it overdrove and burned poorly; swapped out the tube and everything installed easily and burned perfectly. Didn’t entirely realize (until now) this is why, and I may have anotherbon the shelf with a similar problem. Not sure how the old tube got so buggered.

This is a great forum for troubleshooting!

Mike
Every lantern a user...

Mike

Looking for 10/76 birthday lanterns, incl. 200A and any blue Canadian model from then.

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markamulvaney
I’m back! Got my air tube from Old Coleman Parts put everything together and bingo she’s burning like a rocket! Thanks for all the help and advice everyone I really appreciate it. Mark Click image for larger version - Name: 7D23B82C-DDCE-42EF-BC34-91D58341D7F8.jpeg, Views: 55, Size: 20.02 KB Click image for larger version - Name: 154F7879-CBF6-475B-8D9C-F8CBC38E48EB.jpeg, Views: 54, Size: 14.29 KB Click image for larger version - Name: C98B1D5A-A7AE-42C7-A681-6EA815464889.jpeg, Views: 54, Size: 10.67 KB
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Eel
So I have a REALLY WEIRD idea that might be a solution for this problem on 220s. 

I just grabbed a pile of 220 generators, looking to nickel-plate a couple of them.  It seems that two of this set of three new 20170119 date code gens have a "C" tip.  One has the usual "V" tip

-- But you say to me, "the gentip chart says both of those are .008 - what's the big deal, silly eel?
The big deal is that the V tip is externally smaller then the C tip.  A lot smaller.

V tip - 0.156" across flats, square with slightly rounded corners - 0.187 across corners, 0.145" proud of the gen body.
C tip - 0.217" across flats, Hexagonal with sharp corners - 0.250 across corners, 0.170 proud of the identical-manufacture gen body.

Do you suppose, and I DO propose, that a C-tipped gen would be a quick and inexpensive genuine fix for a ratted out air tube?  It looks like the bigger C tip would work best to seal/block damage at the top of the hole, which seems to be the common site.
Conversely, I have a set of Viton gaskets riding on a bet that C-tip generators don't fit into some less-worn air tubes. IMG_20180306_164524586.jpg 
IMG_20180306_164628888.jpg

EEL Eclectic Lanterns, div.  Doofenshmirtz-EEL Incorporated.

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Mister Wilson
If only the tip was sticking into the hole, the size would matter.  Typically the top of the generator body is just into the hole rendering the tips physical size meaningless...typically...
John
H.C. Lanterns dealer
Coleman 275 Appreciation Syndicate #2001 A Turd's Odyssey
Canadian Blues #028
Coleman Slant Saver #31
Looking for 6-56 and 6-58 Birthday lanterns.
There's been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about.
Quote
markamulvaney
On my 220D the hole in the air tube was really butchered, it looked like the PO tried to work on it with a chainsaw. I suspected it was causing my dim yellow burning which several members assured me was the problem.
Mark
Click image for larger version - Name: AC91F174-619A-4C26-B987-0124684DE456.jpeg, Views: 44, Size: 10.83 KB
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Aspbear
I agree with John, the diameter of the tip would have little affect. It would cut the amount of air coming through the hole but you would still be getting additional air and it coming from two different sources would mess up the mixture in the chamber. Plus for any future owners you would have to mark the lantern so they would need the c marked with a C.

Air tubes are easy to come by, it is finding the one that has not been twisted as a lot of people just think the mixing chamber is a good hand hold to turn to loosen or tighten..

Mark the lantern looks great.
G.B. Harp
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Lee8
Very actual for me now!
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